Artificial reefs

[obkdob]

When we hear of few decent fish appearing on our beaches we are all very optimistic about the future of stocks in the area. How many times have these hopes swept away when the inshore trawlers hoover up these fish that would be the hope for the future. Around the North coast in particular would a few strategically places reefs not help? Any ideas?

[x]

Mechanical obstructions to trawlers - like old sunken ships, tyre rafts, etc can act as important refuges for fish. Something as simple and inexpensive as an unknown number of 1 metre boulders scattered around a bay can work equally well - at least in deterring trawlers.

However, rather than trying to obstruct trawlers on their home ground, as it were, we'd be a lot better off all round trying to get as many legal impediments put in the way of trawling as possible.

Fish have survived since just after the dawn of time without man-made habitats. So long as we don't tow away what's naturally their environment, they'll be ok.

A 3 mile Marine Protected Area (MPA - ie no commercial netting) right round the coast would by top of my wish list this Xmas.....

However, Santa won't be coming anytime soon unless every angler in the country gets behind the effort and makes it clear to the politicians that we've had enough. We got rid of the Groceries Order and there are a hell of a lot less fishermen than shopkeepers....think about it....

[John D]

How do we do that?

Any ideas anyone?

Well we could start by answering Roger Baker's request in the editorial section on page 7 of December 2005 Irish Angler.

I'm photocopying the page and sending it to as many TD's as possible with the attached letter:

"Hello,

After reading the attached article in a personal favourite and also very popular publication I was extremely curious to know if your party is acting upon or has plans to act upon the very important issues raised in it?

I look forward to hearing your response.

Regards,
John Devlin"

I hope you all follow in my footsteps??!!
Come on lads and lassies.

[x]

Anyone interested should have a look at the following threads.

http://www.sea-angling-ireland.org/bull ... php?t=3294

http://www.sea-angling-ireland.org/bull ... php?t=3210

Hopefully there's some food for thought, and a nice list of email addresses there. Feel free to adapt any of the material for your own letters/emails.

I got a surprising number of replies from my last mail to these and more are still coming in. A few of the PAs to various politicians still write me and ask for input or advice or to advise me of developments. So writing works....

[Colmm]

I've just come across the link on this thread to Sandmans list of TD's e mail addresses and the letter outling fish stock concerns.
Why isn't this a permanent sticky on the top of each forum? It's a brilliant piece of work but it needs to be a permanent sticky at the top of each forum on here so that people like myself who are relative newcomers to the site (and longtimers) get to see it every time we log on.

So Will it become a sticky?

[x]

"I can make it a sticky. Easy.

And if you wonder why you should be writing and pestering your elected representatives, here's another reason why. Ask yourself why Joe Borg is not being taken to meet representatives of the angling fraternity?

Marine Minister, Pat the Cope Gallagher welcomed EU Fisheries and Maritime Affairs Commissioner Joe Borg to Ireland today.
Commissioner Borg accompanied Minister Gallagher to several venues around the country to gain a first hand view of the Irish Fishing Industry and meet the various stakeholders in the sector.
Kenmare Bay in Co. Kerry was the first destination for the delegation. Here the Commissioner listened to the views of the Irish South and West Fisheries Organisation and the Irish Farmers Association.
A further series of meetings was held near Killarney where Minister Gallagher and Commissioner Borg met with the Irish Fish Producers Organisation and the Irish Fishermen's Organisation representing Aquaculture. He also met with the Irish South and East Fishermen's Organisation and representatives from the Processing Industry.
""I am delighted that Commissioner Borg has taken such an active interest in Irish affairs. This visit is an unique opportunity for the Industry to highlight their concerns to the Commissioner and I hope that the series of meetings we are holding today will enable the Commissioner to obtain an accurate view of the Irish Fishing Industry."" says Minister Gallagher
The delegation continued later that evening to Co. Donegal where a reception and dinner was hosted by Minister Gallagher for Commissioner Borg, his party and Industry representatives. Commissioner Borg will be continuing his visit tomorrow morning with further meetings with Industry Organisations and will be viewing Killybegs Harbour before departing for Belfast."

[John D]

Good stuff Sandman.
You're a breath of fresh air.
I will do everything I can do to get behind this extremely important issue.
The best of luck,
John D

[The Dirty Fecker]

Why not everyone post a pin whiting to their TD and show them 'whats out there' By the time they arrive they should be nice and smelly. It worked with the nappies and might even make the headlines... :P

[x]

"Take a look at these pages. While not exactly the ""4 inch shell"" approach to fishery protection, these folk are not messing around.

http://www.anglers-net.co.uk/sacn/lates ... p?view=429

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe ... 424508.stm

I don't personally approve of these tactics, feeling that a proper legal protection system would be better. Why? Well, all it'll take is for some chancer there to come to grief on one of the obstructions trying to fish between them. Then the commercial lobby will cry about how they're being victimised and are actively being put in danger as they try to get a livelihood out of it...

Then again, the chances of legal protection for marine areas or species in this country appear limited and it seems the commercial fishing industry representatives and their hand-puppets in the DCMNR are going to get their way until we have some major regime changes here.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2005/1111/marine.html

Until such times as anglers and indeed the wider public get together and raise a row about what's going on in Irish waters, fish stocks are going to keep going down."

[John D]

These are some good ideas lads. Even the pin whiting in the post!! I wonder how we could bring the traps idea to the attention of our government?? Heavy fines is one thing, but you also have to catch them first. Plus the damage is already done as the fish will more than likely have been hauled aboard and killed by the time they're caught and fined!!

[x]

John D is quite right about the damage HAVING to be done before any action COULD be taken. Indeed, this is the principle that most illegal fishing operates on, in the knowledge that usually the fines are so small in terms of the profits to be made that it's worth getting caught a few times.

Commercial fishermen are already crying about being criminalised for commiting crimes. They claim they are forced into illegal fishing to remain profitable, despite the grants they receive.

If this is not indicative of an industry that is no longer commercially viable, I don't know what is.

Basically what they'd like to see is them being allowed to do whatever they like and be subsidised to the hilt to do it, and all with no legal repercussions.

I feel that the 3 mile MPA would make it very easy to spot transgressors. All we need then is a suitable penalty. Like the loss of the boat and gear.

Permanently.

[MAC]

I was reading this thread and it reminded me of a recent trip to the the UAE (Fujairah). Diving is a huge source of tourisim there so they have implemented areas of the coast (most of it) that no fishing of any sort is allowed. I was asking why angling was not allowed as this can be a very viable source of tourisim and was told that basically it would be very difficult to inforce size limits ect, so a complete blanket ban is inforce. What was very interesting was that a few years ago they dropped huge (2 tonne) Octogan type boulders with a hallow inside to create an artifical type reef or shelters for juvinille fish. They photographed these boulders only a few months later and already there was a huge amount of small fish to be seen. I think that this would be an excellent idea for Ireland especially in the areas where close in trawling seems to be rampant. It would cost a few quid so is not very likely.

Kev

[rab 525]

even dump a few old engine blocks out in the bay ,trawlers dont hang around much after snaring a few of these as it rolls along the seabed and rolls a net up into a big torn birdnest, heard about a rumour of a boy at this wee trick

[rab 525]

even dump a few old engine blocks out in the bay , : trawlers dont hang around much after snaring a few of these as it rolls along the seabed and rolls a net up into a big torn birdnest, heard about a rumour of a boy at this wee trick

[BigPhil]

even engine blocks or the like with razor wire attached between them!!

[rab 525]

phil do you know the same people as me?, heard of it done of ballygally made a lovely big birdnest of a net

[BigPhil]

dont think it rab, just think it must be common knowledge of an answer to the problem but not practised that much.

[John D]

Sounds like a good idea.
What are engine blocks?

[Bradan]

even dump a few old engine blocks out in the bay ,trawlers dont hang around much after snaring a few of these as it rolls along the seabed and rolls a net up into a big torn birdnest, heard about a rumour of a boy at this wee trick

This is an old trick, used quite successfully in a few rivers where poaching was rampant. Dump an engine block in a holding pool noted for netting and any net that goes in is quickly torn to pieces. Good deterrent. Lose your net once or twice and you won't go back again... only flaw is they also snag fishing tackle :cry:

[skateboy]

Read an article on this a few months ago.practically ANYTHING can be used for an artificial reef,as long as it does'nt contain any pollutants it will support life.1200 old subway carriages were drained of their oil and sunk off the coast of new york,within 2 months 223 adult fish were counted in ONE carriage!the green party wants to do the same with some of the trawlers that are being decommisioned under E.U. guidelines,but the department of the marine are opposed to it and i really dont know why.Any ideas lads?