Mako or White?

[g.wyse]

Great thread lads,i have seen couple of discovery programs on Great Whites i remember seeing that they are only known to breach the surface in one area of the planet ( off the coast of California, Seal island i think :? )there is an area there with certain topography that is totally unique.
Angling and surfing off Kerry is going to be fun this July, lookin forward to it already :shock: :twisted: :twisted: :lol:

[jonny gilbert]

it could have been a great white cause they can change there body temp to suit the climate they are in when looking for food...but then again makos and great whites are members of the same shark group and i think porgies are in the same family too

[Liamo]

Lads,

I saw this thread last week and read it with some interest never thinking I would have something to add to the story, so here goes...

I've taken next week off to do some shore fishing so I headed down to a rock mark not far from Valentia Island this morning to get some mackerel. This place produces mackerel year round for me. It usually takes about and hour or two to get 30 odd fish so armed with my cool box and a couple of spare shrimp rigs I hiked out there at 8 o'clock this morning.

First few casts produced nothing and I was kinda disappointed, it usually doesn't take this long! Looking out to sea maybe ~100yds (def within casting distance) were three huge fins slicing through the water, quartering an area of a couple of hundred square yards. These fish were huge, although it's difficult to gauge I would say the dorsal fins alone were maybe 2 1/2 to 3ft high and completely erect. Although they went subsurface on occasions all three fish stayed on or near the surface with tail/caudal fins out of the water too. I couldn't believe it my jaw literally hit the floor. I watched them patrol this area for maybe an hour with gannets occasionally diving around them but no other sea birds in sight.

I was running through everything in my head - basking, mako, thresher, porgie. Anyways eventually the fish moved off down the coast - they were so bluddy big I could still see 'em. Not five minutes after they left the area low and behold the mackerel were back on the feed out of nowhere and not a fish to be seen all morning! Anyway I kept that first string of mackerel in the water for ages hoping they would detect the presence of distressed fish. However they had moved too far away so eventually I brought in the mackerel and unhooked them, turning back towards the water I nearly died, there not 30 feet out was one of the sharks making a beeline right for me! To be honest even though I was on dry land I got really really scared - this was unreal! The shark came up right along side me - maybe two feet under the surface and so close to the rocks I could have touched him - literally. I couldn't believe it. This thing was anywhere between 15 - 18 feet long, maybe 7 - 9 feet from dorsal to tail and almost the same again on the other side towards the head, it was a gray/brown colour (no spots or mottling of any kind) and very difficult to see even though it was a bright sunny morning and shark was maybe 6 feet from me!? He moved out after this and stayed around for another 15 mins while all the time I was chucking chummed up mackerel in the water but it didn't seem to attract him back in. I don't think it was a basking shark the head just didn't look right - it was sleeker more like a bullet rather than squarer and running to a point?, It didn't have it's mouth open. I couldn't see any pronounced gill rakers. I wasn't squat enough to be a porgie either, thresher was out of the question because of the tail and from looking at as many photo's this morning as I can it wasn't a mako either.

In all honesty when I saw great whites mentioned in this thread last week I passed it off as a bit fanciful. That is until I found this picture on newenglandsharks.net this morning, this is exactly what I saw below in Valentia this morning - no question.

[img]http://www.newenglandsharks.com/_derived/N.ENG.%20whites.htm_txt_gwpix1.gif[/img]

I paid alot of attention to the caudal fin and would like to see one of a basking shark to be sure, I'm sure I could identify it but can't find any clear pic on the net. I will never forget the shape of that tail fin and it looked EXACTLY like the one in that picture. But what sharks hang around together like this, the three of 'em were just cruising for most of the morning? I'll tell ya the place was like a desert when they were around - they definitely put everything else down.

This was one of the most awesome experiences of my life and that is no exaggeration. It will be etched in my memory forever. I am gobsmacked I cannot believe it, my god...

Liam

...oh and after they left grabbed 40 odd mackerel in an hour and went home - why can't everyday be like this!

[Eel Hunter]

This was one of the most awesome experiences of my life and that is no exaggeration. It will be etched in my memory forever. I am gobsmacked I cannot believe it, my god...

Us too, we were not a great distance from Valentia either

[SeanP]

This is a Basking shark from the net, can you rule it out Liam?
A gripping post this one! well done.
Sean,
[img]http://www.cornwalls.co.uk/photos/data/media/8/basking-shark.jpg[/img]

[bigcol]

Will you be looking for a slightly larger reel on e-bay then Sean? :D

[kstaff]

Hi Sean,

fantastic post I must say, very well told, this thread just keeps getting better!! Nothing gets the blood going like Shark stories but to possibly have Great Whites here is amazing and very possible. I don't think I'd sleep for a week with the excitement after an experience like that!


Can't wait for the movie!!!

[col]

Great account your experience there Liam, whether they were whites or not its still amazing to see something like that unexpectadly. 8) Would great whites hang around together like that? I understood that they weren't the most sociable shark.

[rab01]

thats what i believed too col. i'm sure the white shark is a loner. fantastic thread though. would be even better if someone could get a pic of their sighting and we could debate the species even more!!

[SeanP]

Will you be looking for a slightly larger reel on e-bay then Sean? :D

I was thinking maybe your 'Radio' reel might come in handy after all Col!! :wink:


[img]http://www.seanpalmer.hostinguk.com/shorefishing/Rossbehy3.jpg[/img]

[Davy Holt]

Hiya,

That's classic Basking shark behavior, as for the fins have a look at the links below

Baskers tail

http://www.mba.ac.uk/Fellows/Sims/IMAGE ... irdfin.jpg

and both fins

http://www.mba.ac.uk/Fellows/Sims/IMAGES/webbasnavy.JPG

and a basker kidding on it's a GW

http://www.baskingsharks.org/Uploads/1060/egg.jpg

[gearoid mc s.]

i'm sure the white shark is a loner.

it is a solitary animal from what ive read, however makos do shoal together when hunting i think :shock:

[slowarm]

There have been a number of reported sightings in UK and Irish waters over the last few years, so it could very well have been a GW. See this link. http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news ... white.html

However there is doubt, but like others I would not rule them out. Remember it was not many years ago that people would have laughed at the idea of Tuna being caught in Irish waters.

I read about the guy Jack Shine who took porgies from the rocks at Ballyreen, see this link http://www.irish-trophy-fish.com/articles/kevinl.htm

I also had (until recently) and old Sea Fising magazine from the 70's which had an article about some brothers from Clare Island who used to regularly catch porgies and other sharks from rock ledges into deep water on the island.

Only thing to do is keep an eye out and a camera handy.. :D

[PanamaJack]

Lads,

I saw this thread last week and read it with some interest never thinking I would have something to add to the story, so here goes...

I've taken next week off to do some shore fishing so I headed down to a rock mark not far from Valentia Island this morning to get some mackerel. This place produces mackerel year round for me. It usually takes about and hour or two to get 30 odd fish so armed with my cool box and a couple of spare shrimp rigs I hiked out there at 8 o'clock this morning.

First few casts produced nothing and I was kinda disappointed, it usually doesn't take this long! Looking out to sea maybe ~100yds (def within casting distance) were three huge fins slicing through the water, quartering an area of a couple of hundred square yards. These fish were huge, although it's difficult to gauge I would say the dorsal fins alone were maybe 2 1/2 to 3ft high and completely erect. Although they went subsurface on occasions all three fish stayed on or near the surface with tail/caudal fins out of the water too. I couldn't believe it my jaw literally hit the floor. I watched them patrol this area for maybe an hour with gannets occasionally diving around them but no other sea birds in sight.

I was running through everything in my head - basking, mako, thresher, porgie. Anyways eventually the fish moved off down the coast - they were so bluddy big I could still see 'em. Not five minutes after they left the area low and behold the mackerel were back on the feed out of nowhere and not a fish to be seen all morning! Anyway I kept that first string of mackerel in the water for ages hoping they would detect the presence of distressed fish. However they had moved too far away so eventually I brought in the mackerel and unhooked them, turning back towards the water I nearly died, there not 30 feet out was one of the sharks making a beeline right for me! To be honest even though I was on dry land I got really really scared - this was unreal! The shark came up right along side me - maybe two feet under the surface and so close to the rocks I could have touched him - literally. I couldn't believe it. This thing was anywhere between 15 - 18 feet long, maybe 7 - 9 feet from dorsal to tail and almost the same again on the other side towards the head, it was a gray/brown colour (no spots or mottling of any kind) and very difficult to see even though it was a bright sunny morning and shark was maybe 6 feet from me!? He moved out after this and stayed around for another 15 mins while all the time I was chucking chummed up mackerel in the water but it didn't seem to attract him back in. I don't think it was a basking shark the head just didn't look right - it was sleeker more like a bullet rather than squarer and running to a point?, It didn't have it's mouth open. I couldn't see any pronounced gill rakers. I wasn't squat enough to be a porgie either, thresher was out of the question because of the tail and from looking at as many photo's this morning as I can it wasn't a mako either.

In all honesty when I saw great whites mentioned in this thread last week I passed it off as a bit fanciful. That is until I found this picture on newenglandsharks.net this morning, this is exactly what I saw below in Valentia this morning - no question.

[img:693:520]http://www.newenglandsharks.com/_derived/N.ENG.%20whites.htm_txt_gwpix1.gif[/img]

I paid alot of attention to the caudal fin and would like to see one of a basking shark to be sure, I'm sure I could identify it but can't find any clear pic on the net. I will never forget the shape of that tail fin and it looked EXACTLY like the one in that picture. But what sharks hang around together like this, the three of 'em were just cruising for most of the morning? I'll tell ya the place was like a desert when they were around - they definitely put everything else down.

This was one of the most awesome experiences of my life and that is no exaggeration. It will be etched in my memory forever. I am gobsmacked I cannot believe it, my god...

Liam

...oh and after they left grabbed 40 odd mackerel in an hour and went home - why can't everyday be like this!

Hi Liam
As several others have pointed out Great Whites are normally solitary creatures and as rare as the proverbial 'rocking horse faeces', certainly in our part of the North East Atlantic.

Other than perhaps mating they will aggregate in the concentrated presence of prey species. Seal (including Elephant Seals) rookeries or Sea Lions colonies are favoured sites. Places that come to mind are Struissbaai in South Africa, Kangaroo Island – South Australia and the Farallon Islands (close to San Francisco). But putrefying carcasses of whales are also known to attract them. One of our Club members – Sportfishing Club of the British Isles - saw several, literally bloated, in Struissbaai last December having feed on a whale’s blubber.

Back to your observations though. Great Whites have the same bulky build as Porbeagles, but their ‘noses’ do come to a rather pronounced ‘point’ - hence one of their other names ‘White Pointer’.

In my opinion, it does seem most likely that what you saw were Basking Sharks. None the less they’re most impressive.
Dave

[Davy Holt]

Hiya,

There have been a number of reported sightings in UK and Irish waters over the last few years, so it could very well have been a GW. See this link. http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news ... white.html

She also claimed to have seen a mako feeding further out the same day :roll: If I remember correctly she was interviewed after the account and was unable to tell the difference between a Great White and a very common in that area Basking Shark.. hence that "sighting " was thrown out.

[PanamaJack]

Great thread lads,i have seen couple of discovery programs on Great Whites i remember seeing that they are only known to breach the surface in one area of the planet ( off the coast of California, Seal island i think :? )there is an area there with certain topography that is totally unique.
Angling and surfing off Kerry is going to be fun this July, lookin forward to it already :shock: :twisted: :twisted: :lol:

Not quite true, but you're absolutely right topography does undoubtedly influence attack strategies.

As well as the Farallon Islands, out from San Francisco, the other place they perhaps more regularly exhibit that behaviour is around the Fur Seal colonies off South Africa. It was there that the footage from the BBC's Blue Planet series came from.
Dave

[Liamo]

Lads,

I still ain't sure what it is I saw... Those fins of the basking shark don't look right at all, much too rounded on the top and that convex shape on the back edge of the fin doesn't look like what I saw either. Like I said this thing came right up beside me only after those distressted mackerel were in the water for a while.

But 3 of 'em? Looked odd, do either species shoal together like that. I had hoped it'd be easier if I saw some clear photo's of the tails but to be honest from the photo's above it's still very difficult.

I'm off fishing all this week and if the weather clears will be back down there for a look - will keep ye posted

The debate rages on I guess!!!

Liam

[donal domeney]

Lads,

I still ain't sure what it is I saw... Those fins of the basking shark don't look right at all, much too rounded on the top and that convex shape on the back edge of the fin doesn't look like what I saw either. Like I said this thing came right up beside me only after those distressted mackerel were in the water for a while.


The debate rages on I guess!!!

Liam

Took these pics of a basking shark on april 6th. this year while fishing off culoo rock the fish swam right under the rock

[donal domeney]

To eliminate an other of the large species seen in Irish water. These were taken inside Cork harbour on june 2001, before the digital days

[PanamaJack]

Just really for completeness I've added a couple of images of Great Whites that might help Eel Hunter and Liam in determining what they actually saw.

One's unfortunately on a gantry in South Australia, but you can clearly see the shape of the Dorsal and 'notched' upper tail lobe. The other might be more useful in that it shows the girth of one as it approaches the boat and its 'pointed' snout.