Master Angler Comp

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#61 Post by **BigPhil** » Thu Sep 21, 2006 6:05 pm

well, i guess too that if the cv system was the road people went down that it might not work out either...eg, you could be a very competent match angler suitable for the team , but perhaps unemployed or whatever and not fish a lot of matches in the previous year or whatever and therefore out of contention straight away....also more matches may be fished in one province than others giving some guys a better chance at producing a better cv....
another avenue for possible complaints would be who would be choosen to be on the selection panel...
anyhow, i really dont think this road should even be considered if we want to have clubs left in the federation.

there are pros and cons for any system that is used, even with the latest one introduced and no matter what, you are never going to have a system that every one is happy with

personally speaking i had no problem with the last system that was used, as it produced a good/decent team every year....my problem is that once the team has been sorted it is the follow up , between the masters and the world championships that needs to be improved, any of the guys who are at the masters are good enough anglers, some better than others, and if they are coached and managed in the correct manner to suit the venue that they are going to for the world championships they will be able to adapt themselves better to the conditions and style of fishing etc.

take the boat team that has just returned from portugal for example...i believe that they finished in the best position that an irish boat team has done for many years....partly down to the fact that 2 of the guys on it had been away there before, got the team together for a team practice or two before they went out to portugal, brought all the gear, rigs, etc etc that they would need to go there and passed on all the advise they could. to me, this has worked well and goes to show that even with the old shore system....which is still used for the boats....that a good team can be produced if the right thing is done with them before they go. fair play to heiko once again.

rob hit on a point there , the system he was suggesting basically is the one that is used for selecting the home nations teams.....no one complains about it really as it works fairly well and is inclusive of everyone, and every province, at the end of the day, its about working with each other, not against each other and the sooner this comes into play , the better for the ifsa and every member in it.

rant over for now......

#62 Post by **weaverbeaver** » Thu Sep 21, 2006 6:08 pm

I,ve been following all this stuff about the selection process for the National team and noted many of the comments especially those made by Staurty about junior coaching. From visiting the Kilmore SAC web-site I noticed that they have enjoyed huge sucess with their juniors,apparently they have had a member and sometimes two & three members on Junior & Under-21 teams since 2000. This is some record, can any club come close to that even. These guys must be doing something right. I agree with Stuarty about the future being in the Hands of the countrys young anglers.

#63 Post by **kilmoresac** » Thu Sep 21, 2006 7:20 pm

The opening session of this years Master Angler will take place in the Kilmuckridge area, fishing 10:00am to 2:00pm, the second session in Rostoonstown 7 to 11pm with the final session in the Kaats on Sunday 10 to 2pm. All these venues are capable of producing good catches. Reports from the venues can be seen on our web-site http://www.kilmoresac.com
By the way, one of our lads was top Irish rod on the Shore team in the World Championships hope he's regarded as a 'top angler' by all concerned. Oh! wont be dragged any further into this debate & thanks for the compliment about our juniors, that was achieved by plenty of hard work with a group of very dedicated young anglers.

#64 Post by **jonny gilbert** » Thu Sep 21, 2006 8:55 pm

[quote="weaverbeaver"]I,ve been following all this stuff about the selection process for the National team and noted many of the comments especially those made by Staurty about junior coaching. From visiting the Kilmore SAC web-site I noticed that they have enjoyed huge sucess with their juniors,apparently they have had a member and sometimes two & three members on Junior & Under-21 teams since 2000. This is some record, can any club come close to that even. These guys must be doing something right. I agree with Stuarty about the future being in the Hands of the countrys young anglers.[/quot

my club cbarsac have had the same sucess with the teams national and regional....ive been on the national team once in 2002 and the under 21 regional team 4 times since 2002 and dinger and mark rainey 3 times each since 2003

#65 Post by **petekd** » Thu Sep 21, 2006 8:56 pm

I hope your not coming to N V S meet Jonny!!!

#66 Post by **Cooke** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 8:45 am

I agree totally with all the comments regarding promotion of junior anglers and coaching of the international teams.

I was not suggesting adopting a cv system, merely stating that any system based on results can not by definition be biased towards any region. If a particular region does not run opens, that is their option and their decision.

#67 Post by **nthclare** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 10:58 am

There are many good anglers from clubs all over Ireland who enjoy representing their club in the master angler I dont know what this guy is on about 10 or 12 good anglers in the master angler lol I out fished many of these so called super stars in the sea angling world both pleasure fishing and match fishing its all about luck at the end of the day and match fishing is a sport to be enjoyed and is for everyone not just the ones who call them selves after some rod.

Steve keep up the good posts

#68 Post by **stevecrow74** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 2:00 pm

Neilus wrote:There are many good anglers from clubs all over Ireland who enjoy representing their club in the master angler I dont know what this guy is on about 10 or 12 good anglers in the master angler lol I out fished many of these so called super stars in the sea angling world both pleasure fishing and match fishing its all about luck at the end of the day and match fishing is a sport to be enjoyed and is for everyone not just the ones who call them selves after some rod.

Steve keep up the good posts

thats nearly what i said in the begining (and the riot that followed

)

i find you will learn from every one... no matter how long they have been fishing.. i've been fishing my whole life and i'm still learning little tricks here and there, from some of the unlikliest of places too

Anonymous · #69 Post by **Anonymous** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 1:38 pm

I've removed the content of this post.

Sandman

#70 Post by **jonny gilbert** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 2:41 pm

wont be there petekd unfortunately got the UPC closed gold that weekend to try and qualify for the under21's again and maybe the senior team but if another N v S comes up i will definitely be there

#71 Post by **stevecrow74** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 2:49 pm

jonny gilbert wrote:wont be there petekd unfortunately got the UPC closed gold that weekend to try and qualify for the under21's again and maybe the senior team but if another N v S comes up i will definitely be there

good luck in that... and if i have anything to do with it there will be a second N v's S... just to give those northerners a chance to catch some fish...

Anonymous · #72 Post by **Anonymous** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:03 pm

Content removed by Sandman.

One of the two of us is about to get banned. And it ain't me....

#73 Post by **stevecrow74** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:33 pm

Something Fishy wrote:Content removed by Sandman.

One of the two of us is about to get banned. And it ain't me....

your not funny.. give it up.... and grow up...

#74 Post by **MAC** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 11:42 am

Being fairly new to match fishing I have been reading this thread with great interest. Some super points about the selection system. Just thinking about it I think that the current system is good, but needs a little extending. Personally I think that the idea of best club person fishing the competition is excellent. How are we to progress without this system. Perhaps the Master angler needs to be turned into a small league of perhaps 4 weekends or legs, one in each province. This would give a better representation of a persons ability co consistintly fish well. Also, the idea of single person clubs is a farce, and this should be shut down immediatly. It would be more difficult for people to make a number of matches with the club commitments and such, but if you would like to fish for your country and your serious about it, I'm sure there wouldn't be too much of a problem.

Also, in any sport you need to be prepared. As Bigphil mentioned, if there is no follow up, then you are up the creak from the start. I think in competive sport you need to be more prepared than the next guy all the time, then you'll see some results.

Great thread, keep up the input,

Kev

#75 Post by **BigPhil** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 6:05 pm

the problem comes if you go down the route of the master league or whatever, be it four legs or four weekends or whatever.....finance, some of the guys maybe unemployed or on a low income, this means it may not be viable for them to enter it, thus doing away with their chances straight away.

some clubs are running just for the sake of a few guys to try to get to the master angler, sometimes with just a very small number of members, personally i dont agree with it, but, the federation still depends on these clubs to help with its running costs via their affiliation fees etc

their are so many different ideas on how the national team should be selected that no matter what , everyone will never be happy.

at the end of the day, their should be an equal chance for every man or woman in the federation to make the teams, not just for those who can afford to run here there and everywhere to try to qualify

also on the qualifiers...presently master angler and fish off pool..... i believe that something should be looked at as regards to bait.
i think that for everyone to have an equal chance once they get to this stage that you should pay so much as part of your entry fee and that everyone should get the same bait from the organisers so as its a level playing field as far as it is concerned....ie the guy who can afford to buy the biggest variety of bait or bring the biggest bucket of prime peeler crab or whatever is not at any bigger of an advantage as the guy who cannot afford it.
at the end of the day, once the guys make the world team they have to get used to fishing in these conditions with the bait being drawn for and issued out to the team captain/manager on the morning of each competition anyhow.....no secret additives or baits that are exclusive more so to certain areas etc to leave any angler at an advantage, so as it comes down more so to angling skill and knowledge.

#76 Post by **Donagh** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 9:06 am

Phil has put a better explaination to why the change to the rules in our club were objected to so strongly . I didn't mean any offence to cooke about mentioning bias but it was more meant if we switched to a cv system there could be accusations of it even if it didn't exist.

Donagh

#77 Post by **Cooke** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 11:56 am

Donagh - no offence taken at any comments.

#78 Post by **MAC** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 11:58 am

Very interesting points Phil.

I agree that if it were a mini league that the costs may be a problem for some and we wan't to include everyone, but I think it is the only real way to reduce the element of luck and increase the element of skill. I'm guessing that once you've qualified that there are even more costs to yourself with travel and such, so if you wan't to qualify to fish for Ireland an element of cost is to be expected from the start.

I understand that this might be difficult for some people to bear but IMO it is the lesser of the two evils.

I think your bait point is really interesting. We should be trying to put our potentional qualifers under the same situations they will face when they travel abroad to fish for Ireland, and like you mention this will also increase the element of skill involved. Was this idea ever raised at committe level

and did it recieve any backing

Kev

bass boy · #79 Post by **bass boy** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 2:11 pm

weaverbeaver wrote:Does anyone have any info on the Shore Master Angler. I believe its somewhere in Wexford, I would love to go and have a look at the top anglers in action at this competition. Venues, times etc please

one guy asks a question and instead of giving him an answer,the whole thing turns into a slanging match.

#80 Post by **pete** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 4:00 pm

I'm the same is you Mac only really started match fishing last year and have found this discussion one of the most interesting on the site for a long time.

The bait issue is something that I've wondered about....whereby people with more free time to dig or money to buy can have a distinct advantage. Then again is bait collection not supposed to be another skill that the good angler should possess....

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