This forum is for general discussion related to Angling. Areas covered would include Media Reports, Conservation Issues and the promotion of the sport.
JimH wrote:I believe the Bass Policy and other species policies too, is being announced/confirmed at IFI headquarters in citywest on friday morning at 11:00.
This is interesting. If they are putting solid dates on its implementation and more resources into the enforcement aspects of the policy, it is a very welcome step forward and to be acknowledged.
Its also a golden opportunity too for them to acknowledge the concerns of bass anglers around the coast of the huge decline in stocks in places like Wexford and Dublin. Even if the IFI don't have the answers at this point in time, I would feel some kind of relief if they were to at least acknowledge that there is an issue and they are looking into it.
Does anyone know if Irish Bass or any other angler group/people will be at it? Its a great opportunity to draw attention to the live issues on the ground and gauge the IFI's awareness acknowledgment. Anybody going along?
I am heading up to Citywest tomorrow for the launching of the Bass Policy document. As far as I'm aware this means that it is now official IFI policy. Up until now they did not have a specific policy on bass management. That in itself is a step forward.
Most of the Board members, the senior management of the IFI and some senior civil servants will be there. (no minister though). I plan to use the opportunity to highlight the current problems we face with the bass stocks and to push for quick implementation of some of the key proposals like a one fish bag limit and a 50cm mls. In my opinion, time is not on our side.
I will report back here with any progress made when I return at the weekend.
I sincerely hope so JimH! I believe this will represent a very positive step forward in the protection and conservation of the fish we love the most
Harsh and real words JohnQ - but like I said above this will hopefully represent fairly tangible progress, even if not directly effecting protection immediately.
Can I start to get a little bit excited that something big is perhaps starting to rumble and awaken around our shores - probably not but here's hoping!
"Once you choose hope, anything's possible." - Christopher Reeve
Protect the magical sport of sea angling and spread the word that conservation is the way forward. Put fish back!!!!
Thanks JohnQ, with a group like that gathered, it's a great opportunity to impress on them the current state of play in some parts of the country and gauge their reaction.
I'm particularly interested to see if they acknowledge that there are specific problems in Dublin and Wexford (I can't speak for further afield with any hard degree of knowledge, maybe others can add). Angling pressure and illegal pressure can't be counting for all of it. We have marks that see little activity that are devoid of fish, marks that were consistent from 12/13 years ago until about 3 years ago and then rapidly declined.
It would give very good encouragement and be a great starting point if they recognised these issues and were working to understand them in tandem with implementing the bass policy.
I think my fear would be that they announce the bass plan as being the panacea to the bass issues. Its a great step forward but I would strongly feel that there is more going on in terms of declines in parts of the country that the plan won't reverse on it own.
P.S. - I just watched Steve's youtube clip of the stranded trawler and if they were actually dropping nets in that close it's absolutely disgusting, greedy and displays total contempt towards the future and present protection/conservation of our small inshore fish stocks!
I just could not believe what I was seeing!
And by the way very well said MackDublin!
John D.
Protect the magical sport of sea angling and spread the word that conservation is the way forward. Put fish back!!!!
Any person with a modicum of common sense looks forward to the launch of the policy documents this morning at IFI. In this instance any person interested in the current and future state of bass fishing should be to some degree celebrating the launch of the National Bass Policy.
The team members of the policy group have worked hard to achieve what is in my opinion on the basis of the draft a strong document. We could discuss many aspects of it over many hours no doubt!
Using the same common sense when applied to the ‘implementation’ of the policy and you quickly arrive at the conclusion that IFI is probably and more than likely under resourced in achieving all of the objectives, and this is only when you consider the bass policy.
During the initial meetings and early formation of the first Irish Bass group, the scope of what was required to cover the wider aspects of the bass fishery and its development coupled to protection was quickly realised. The group decided its focus was to be based on illegal fishing as a singular objective.
However it was my particular interest to develop the wider aspects of what may have been required. As is the case with many scenarios like this it ran into quicksand and stalled. Life gets in the way sometimes, its normal!
It is my belief today that no one single person can be ‘responsible’ for all of the aspects of bass angling in this country no matter what they may be – this is not a criticism but a practical observation.
There has been much discussion here on the subject which has evolved from Crevans initial concerns about the lack of bass in Wexford and finally arriving somewhere close to the possible meeting of people to assist the Irish Bass organisation.
Recognising the under resourcing at IFI, most companies would probably ‘outsource’ requirements, leaves the possibility of the recognition that some of the aspects of the implementation of the bass policy could in fact be accomplished and achieved by a wider and capable group of people coupled to a proper division and allocation of diverse responsibilities and interests based on genuine trust.
However,do they become a moot point when we all know that lack of enforcement means that many will ignore them, as with the current regulations?
Also, just to be clear, are they proposals you would like to see in the document, or are they definitely going to be in it?
I would just be worried that any document would focus it's efforts on recreational angling and not pay enough heed to illegal netting or trawling incidents like we had in Cork harbour last year.
JimH wrote:
There has been much discussion here on the subject which has evolved from Crevans initial concerns about the lack of Bass in Wexford and finally arriving somewhere close to the possible meeting of people to assist the Irish Bass organisation.
Recognising the under resourcing at IFI, most companies would probably ‘outsource’ requirements, leaves the possibility of the recognition that some of the aspects of the implementation of the Bass policy could in fact be accomplished and achieved by a wider and capable group of people coupled to a proper division and allocation of diverse responsibilities and interests based on genuine trust.
This is how things get done.
I think these 2 paragraphs hit the nail on the head.
With the IFI under resourced but intent (and rightly so) on pushing out more conservation measures to protect bass, it just makes practical sense that they would seek help to share the load.
There are willing anglers (recreational/guides/tackle shops) dotted around the coast as has been evidenced in this thread and others.
Surely its key that they have a link to the IFI of some description to become more involved, whether it be eyes and ears on the ground, feedback on the state of fishing etc etc. Our input must have some value if its delivered in a coherent way.
It seems to me that this could be Irish Bass but we can't expect John Q to have his finger on the fishing pulse from Dublin to Louth no more then I know whats happening in Kerry. It needs a broad base of people interested in helping and an opening out of communications between such a group and the IFI.
shortcircuit wrote:Tanglerat, the proposals above are laudable.
However,do they become a moot point when we all know that lack of enforcement means that many will ignore them, as with the current regulations?
Also, just to be clear, are they proposals you would like to see in the document, or are they definitely going to be in it?
I would just be worried that any document would focus it's efforts on recreational angling and not pay enough heed to illegal netting or trawling incidents like we had in Cork harbour last year.
And in this lies the success or failure of a policy with regards any type of fishery. Get a group of experienced and 'informed' practitioners together and they will very quickly come to a consensus regarding what needs to be done. Equally quickly the politicians will embrace the recommendations and pass it into regulation and law because it makes it look as if the are actually 'doing something' to earn their inflated salaries. However unless they follow through with the necessary resources to ensure that the regulations are RIGIDLY enforced, all that went before is a complete waste of time and effort.
The statute books are stuffed to bursting with unenforced non-priority legislation.
Priority legislation would be something like the Water charges.
These new proposals look good and is a step in the right direction in my opinion.
The underlying concern is the policing of current and future legislation. The organization of groups in support of Irish bass conservation to work with the IFI is a fundamental foundation on which to build upon.
Going forward I believe that it is up to us as anglers to protect what we have. If this means working with Irish Bass or the IFI then this is what is required.
Its our fishing we want to protect so we should be willing to be involved ourselves
The strategy and the policy needs to evolve and become integrated perceived and wholly understood as a contributing factor to the enhancement of rural marine communities.
Considering enforcement only as a solution means your looking in the wrong direction as a starting point.
Let me give you an example of what I am talking about - during the season of 2011 / 2012 I worked hard to attempt to win an award at the Wexford Business Awards Ceremony. This was an objective of mine for many reasons (not specifically tourism related), and I never really felt that I would have won anything. After a rigorous interview process which was then followed by presentations to a panel and more interviews I felt I did the best I could for Wexford and the fish.
There were 72 shortlisted finalists involved in the Business Awards that year
The finalists below were those in the Tourism category
Celtic link ferries
Griffin group
Irish national heritage park
Kellys resort hotel
Morriscastle strand holiday park
Talbot hotel Wexford
Wexford festival opera
Whites of Wexford
Whitford house hotel South East Angling Ireland
Now I happened to win runner up (to Kellys Hotel) in the tourism category. So what?
Remove 'Jim Hendrick' from the equation and substitute bass angling - so it now reads Bass Angling wins tourism award in South East. Probably the first of its kind for any bass angling enterprise perhaps.
On that night Bass Angling held its own as an integrated viable tourism and socio positive product that was recognized by its local industry peers.
Ask yourself how much time do we spend discussing the realisation that IFI DO NOT have the resources at their disposal to eliminate illegal fishing - hundreds of hours. We know this is not a solution.
Now ask yourself how much time was dedicated to 'promoting' even mentioning the simple fact above that on a wider scale 'Bass angling wins tourism award'?
Was it strongly emphasised say by IFI, angling notes in the Irish Times, UKbass, Irishbass, The Lure Forum, Sea Angling Ireland, Labrax squad? This is not a criticism by the way but just and observation, but this type of integrated support recognition adds credibility to all levels of bass angling.
In other words Bass Angling in Ireland is winning tourism awards because.....
And don't for heaven sake dont get me wrong this is not about 'me' but given that we spend a hell of a lot of time talking about lack of enforcement, and I even read recently where one UK angling journalist talks about lack of promotion, - then where are we spending any time talking about and recognising and promoting the valuable stuff that the community needs to be aware of both in terms of its contribution and need for sustainable management that is already happening on the ground?
Where to start? In spite of all the problems associated with implementation and enforcement of what is now IFI bass policy, it has to be considered a step forward that the IFI at least have a bass policy. I have to believe that it is better late than never.
If all of us involved in bass angling are to be brutally honest we need to admit that the strategies that we have used to protect and improve the stock have failed. In my opinion they will continue to fail unless more people become directly involved in the fight to turn things around and believe me it will not be easy. I have chased politicians down corridors trying to influence them, I have fought with leading fisheries scientists who would use their influence to destroy our bass stock, I have fostered relationships with those involved in management and spent years building bridges with angling lobby groups across Europe but while we may have won the battle in holding on to our legislation we may well be losing the war with our bass stock. Any why me - I simply was the last one standing and I also felt that it was vital that someone who made his living from bass angling was there when trying to get a better deal for anglers. Could I have done more, of course but like lots of other people life and work gets in the way.
The future. Irish Bass is still a very good vehicle to excerpt influence on decision makers. I am more than happy to continue but help from anglers and particularly those involved in bass angling businesses is vital. Working alone has many advantages but as I said earlier if the strategies I employed had been successful we would have a lot more bass now. Things need to change.
I believe that there is enough resources in the IFI to vastly improve and protect the bass stock. Its not the lack of resources but the lack of will and motivation. Pressure can and will change this. This is where those that are prepared to get involved can help. In my opinion the only way forward is working with the IFI. For all their faults they are the only show in town. No organisation can or should get involved in any sort of vigilantism.
Because of the new bass policy, there is an opportunity to get involved in its implementation. It simply can not be allowed to gather dust on the book shelf of each regional office. It may take a long time to get to where we want to go but if we don't make the first step we will never get there.
I have no free time before early November but a meeting open to all is badly needed to get things moving.
