Bass being commercially exploited again!?

[SandTiger]

Lads
Just for clarity, this is the line south of which the FIF propose fishing for Bass. Saying it is 50km off the SE coast is technically correct, but entirely disingenuous and misleading, the line actually crosses the SW coast, which would make inshore fishing legal in this area.

It actually appears that you are the one that is being disingenuous and misleading. FIF want to fish below 51.3 degrees N, yet you show an image with a a big red line at 51.5 degrees N to support your argument and generate a bit of shock and support. A degree of Latitude for this area equals 60.07 nautical miles and your most Southerly mainland point is 51.43 degrees N, so this places them outside Inshore Fisheries.

[Tomaszek]

Hi All,
just quick update on work progress.

I got poster partially done (need to compile text with artwork)

I'm looking to be sending poster ready to print to Tony on Sat/Sun and web page to be placed on irishbass.org to teacher tomorrow.

So our campaign (big word) should start next week.

That's it for now - any input, ideas and suggestions as always welcome.

Thanks!

[JonnyB]

[quote="SandTiger"]It actually appears that you are the one that is being disingenuous and misleading. FIF want to fish below 51.3 degrees N, yet you show an image with a a big red line at 51.5 degrees N to support your argument and generate a bit of shock and support. A degree of Latitude for this area equals 60.07 nautical miles and your most Southerly mainland point is 51.43 degrees N, so this places them outside Inshore Fisheries.

Just to clarify, the FIF proposal is to allow fishing south of 51 degrees 30 minutes N. This is 51.5 degrees, as there are 60 minutes in a degree. So Bradan is correct, and the FIF are being disingenuous and dishonest as usual.

[Tomaszek]

area south of the 51.30’N

My understanding is that this is 3/10 of a degree - not 30 minutes.

By the way - this only proves how much we need to prepare as even interpretation of such simple data is causing confusion among us (angler's community).

[Mohawk]

There's exactly 20nm in the difference between 51.30 and 51.50,, Jayzus have we any navigators here

[SandTiger]

area south of the 51.30’N

My understanding is that this is 3/10 of a degree - not 30 minutes.

Or simply put, 3 cables?

By the way - this only proves how much we need to prepare as even interpretation of such simple data is causing confusion among us (angler's community).

Yep

[bigsod]

I know nothing about fish stocks,fishing legislation,protected areas, quotas, navagation and for that matter i hardly know what a bass looks like, but i do know that if sand tiger was truly interested in the subject he woulnt have such a belittling attitude towords those trying to make a difference. Keep up the good work lads

[SandTiger]

I know nothing about fish stocks,fishing legislation,protected areas, quotas, navagation and for that matter i hardly know what a Bass looks like, but i do know that if sand tiger was truly interested in the subject he woulnt have such a belittling attitude towords those trying to make a difference. Keep up the good work lads

Since you openly admit that you know nothing BigSod, would you rather me butt out from trying to assist and offer my opinion, despite it not being proffered in the blinkered, backslapping manner that you may be accustomed too?

Don't get me wrong, I have yet to be convinced by any of you as to why the FIF proposal lacks merit, beyond the pathetic cries of "I don't want it... because... but... because I don't, right", or that such a proposal will automatically impact on your own wee hobby, because you have failed to produce any credible data to support your argument.

However; as an angler I feel that you deserve the best possible representation available. And no, I don't suffer fools gladly, in any walk of life.

I hope that serves to clarify matters.

[clownfish]

Lads been offline for awhile now ,but want to lend a hand in supporting the CONTINUOUS protection of Irish Bass.And will be getting in touch with my local td and councilor to highlight this issue and possible disaster and repeat of history.Still trying to get my head around this and confused beyond believe.So glad we dont have tigers,polar bears or any protected or near extinct animals /mammals in Ireland ,because i truly feel they would have been distant memories in irish folklore.Has the Cod ban been lifted in Canada can anyone tell me ?Ask the Coyser what the canadian navy do to illegally caught Cod by commercials fishing boats.Shoot first ask questions later.
Jay

[bigsod]

I know nothing about fish stocks,fishing legislation,protected areas, quotas, navagation and for that matter i hardly know what a Bass looks like, but i do know that if sand tiger was truly interested in the subject he woulnt have such a belittling attitude towords those trying to make a difference. Keep up the good work lads

Since you openly admit that know nothing BigSod, would you rather me butt out from trying to assist and offer my opinion, despite it not being proffered in the blinkered, backslapping manner that you may be accustomed too?

Don't get me wrong, I have yet to be convinced by any of you as to why the FIF proposal lacks merit, beyond the pathetic cries of "I don't want it... because... but... because I don't, right", or that such a proposal will automatically impact on your own wee hobby, because you have failed to produce any credible data to support your argument.

However; as an angler I feel that you deserve the best possible representation available. And no, I don't suffer fools gladly, in any walk of life.

I hope that serves to clarify matters.

As clear as mud
I dont suffer fools gladly, thats why i was compelled to reply to your constant puting down and mocking of people. You may be trying to bring people to see your point of view but what your actualy doing is putting peoples back up and even though you seem to have a good grasp of the facts and are making a half decent argument you will never get people to see your point of veiw by insulting their intelligence.And i admire your persistance, theres my back slap out of the way

[SandTiger]

As clear as mud
I dont suffer fools gladly, thats why i was compelled to reply to your constant puuting down and mocking of people. Youmay be trying to bring people to see your point of view but what your actualy doing is putting peoples back up and even though you seem to have a good grasp of the facts and are making a half decent argument you will never get people to see your point of veiw by insulting their intelligence.And i admire your persistance, theres my back slap out of the way

BigSod, I have no personal interest in making anyone see my apparent point of view, because your Bass Fisheries simply does not effect me, does that make sense to you?

You need to all get your act together and if you can' handle a little honest criticism from an amateur like me, then God help you when you have to deal with the Commercials and God help your beloved Bass.

Show me where I have put down or mocked one person before they have chosen to take a pop at me on this thread?

My persistence is based on the fact that I care enough to see you formulate cohesive arguments to retain your sport.

[Mohawk]

Here's a fact n figure that may be of use to some of you guys save you all some confusion

A nautical mile is a length of one minute latitude along any meridian. therefore 51.50 -51.30 = 20 NM

Don't mix up Latitue with Longtiude

[rustyhookthomas]

hey people, i've been reading this from the start and did just that.
thanks to all the e-mail ministers addresses... i mailed my opinion, no replies yet!
my point here would be,
Bass are protected in ireland, we all know the rules....
19 years to get to where we are. things are looking good with bass fishing.
last year was my best year bass fishing as i caught quite a few!!! before last year i caught one in
courtmacsherry 2/3 years ago, i've been fishing for 30 years! with no bass at all!
i returned all bar 2 bass in my fishing over the years and still got stick here for doing so!
i'm scared at the possibility of never catching a bass in the next 30 years if the laws change regarding bass in ireland.
the bass hobby and 19 years work will be gone in one year if this legislation changes!
the impact on anglers and tourism etc, will be enormous but for fishermen, it will be a short-term boost, one, maybe two seasons and we'll be going back and beyond the 19 years of recovery will be lost!
19 years without commercial bass fishing!
a change here will not save the fishermen, but it will end tourism angling.
not just from abroad but from the people in ireland that travel the country enjoying the hotspots of angling!
that's my rant done!

[Tomaszek]

51.30’N

Hey

This is slightly off topic but I think it is worth clarifying. Questions to all ye skippers and navigators.

Latitude quoted above (from FIF proposal) is not right either - and maybe that's where confusion comes from.

If we talking degrees and tenths of degree shouldn't it be
51.30° N

And if we talking degrees and minutes shouldn't it be
51° 30' N

So it seems to be mix of both.

[Mohawk]

51.30’N

Hey

This is slightly off topic but I think it is worth clarifying. Questions to all ye skippers and navigators.

Latitude quoted above (from FIF proposal) is not right either - and maybe that's where confusion comes from.

If we talking degrees and tenths of degree shouldn't it be
51.30° N

And if we talking degrees and minutes shouldn't it be
51° 30' N

So it seems to be mix of both.

This is actually raising the facts n figures point again very nicely, there is a big difference with 51.30 being 9nm south of and with 51 30 being 3nm north of Brow Head, Ireland's southern most point... Before some of you post don't assume the answer to which one it is you'll only sound an idiot you need to confirm this!

By the way has anyone here actually got a copy of or have a link to the actual FIF proposal.. We need to see exactly what they are proposing.. (we know everyone here's interpretation of it, but it's the actual proposal we need to be looking at!)

[RockHunter]

his is actually raising the facts n figures point again very nicely, there is a big difference with 51.30 being 9nm south of and with 51 30 being 3nm north of Brow Head, Ireland's southern most point... Before some of you post don't assume the answer to which one it is you'll only sound an idiot you need to confirm this!

Very true - I was interpreting it to be 51 degrees, 30 minutes as it was written as 30' in an early post on this topic. I had also seen the map that Bradan posted someplace else - probably another thread on this forum, but is vital to establish whether the latitude FIF are talking about is in degrees and minutes or in decimal degrees.

[Bradan]

his is actually raising the facts n figures point again very nicely, there is a big difference with 51.30 being 9nm south of and with 51 30 being 3nm north of Brow Head, Ireland's southern most point... Before some of you post don't assume the answer to which one it is you'll only sound an idiot you need to confirm this!

Very true - I was interpreting it to be 51 degrees, 30 minutes as it was written as 30' in an early post on this topic. I had also seen the map that Bradan posted someplace else - probably another thread on this forum, but is vital to establish whether the latitude FIF are talking about is in degrees and minutes or in decimal degrees.

This is the original email from the Dept:

The Minister of State (MOS) has received representations from Mr Tony Killeen TD, Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries & Food regarding a proposal by The Federation of Irish Fishermen (FIF) to allow Irish commercial fishing vessels to target sea bass and land it when caught in offshore waters. FIF proposal is that they propose that Irish regulations be changed to permit Irish commercial fishing vessels to retain and land sea bass caught south of (51.30’N) in area VII. This area is approx 50 km off the SE coast of Ireland and the UK advice for 2007 states that this stock is in a healthy state. FIF in making this proposal is taking a precautionary approach to avoid any fishing whatsoever of the Irish inshore stock. If the sea bass fishery is opened in the area south of the 51.30’N, FIF is fully committed to engaging with the Marine Institute through the Industry/Science partnership to work at carrying out a full assessment on the stock North of this position in area VII.

Two points - it says 51.30' - the decimal point would suggest decimal but the apostrohpe suggests 30 minutes, or 0.5 degrees. Secondly, it states the area is approx. 50km off the SE coast - 51.5N is actually about 75km off the SE coast and 51.3N would be significantly further off the coast, which suggests that it is 51.5 or 51 30' N that is referred to.

The sentence "FIF in making this proposal is taking a precautionary approach to avoid any fishing whatsoever of the Irish inshore stock" is absolute BS in my opinion, as they are well aware the inshore stock will be available for fishing under this proposal.

[jd]

I had also seen the map that Bradan posted someplace else - probably another thread on this forum, but is vital to establish whether the latitude FIF are talking about is in degrees and minutes or in decimal degrees.

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=21543&p=165805&

[Mohawk]

Two points - it says 51.30' - the decimal point would suggest decimal but the apostrohpe suggests 30 minutes, or 0.5 degrees. Secondly, it states the area is approx. 50km off the SE coast - 51.5N is actually about 75km off the SE coast and 51.3N would be significantly further off the coast, which suggests that it is 51.5 or 51 30' N that is referred to.

That's an error margin of at least 50% So we can not gain any information with any certainty from it so can some one get some confirmation or better still an actual copy of the proposal! It's only a small job for your public reps

You're only banging your heads off a brick wall until you have the actual facts of the proposal

[teacher]

You're only banging your heads off a brick wall until you have the actual facts of the proposal

My heads getting sore so I've just posted an FOI request.

We could also ask the FIF what they're proposing